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Going From Lank to Tank

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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by Dave on Fri Jan 18, 2013 6:30 am

Yeah, I've been home from work now for just about six hours, so it's getting to be about bed time... if there is such a thing... :facepalm:
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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by Dave on Fri Jan 18, 2013 6:31 am

Iliander wrote:About those HeSPUs, I myself experienced that taking a 2 day break from them will almost always hinder progress. Doing them almost daily is best, imo.

Josh said this too. I'm afraid to do it, but I know deep down that you're both right. I guess I'll have at 'er again, and really watch the wrists for any signs of trouble this time.
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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by Josh T. on Fri Jan 18, 2013 11:07 am

Dave, start with 2 days/week, and move up to 4-5 days/week over time if you're worried about your wrists. They go up faster the higher the frequency, but I find that just getting into a handstand for a few minutes each day prevents any regressing of the movement. I do HeSPU stuff 4 days/week, the other 3 I kick up into handstands. So I would start with that first. Make it your goal to do HS for 5 minutes/day. Then, slowly work up the frequency like I mentioned above.
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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by Journeyman on Fri Jan 18, 2013 4:21 pm

Dave.cyco wrote:
Conventional Deadlift Lockouts (from the rack @ 275)
0:20, PR 0:22 PR , 0:16, 0:10, 0:24

Double overhand, yes?
With the grip I'd just say make sure the bar isn't too high in your palm and you're not trying to crush grip it... making sure your wrist is completely straight in line with your forearm is a good cue too; for some reason I screw that one up sometimes.

275x15 on snatch grip deads is pretty good; that *should* put you right around 350 or so... didn't you say you were better at repping those than normal deadlifts though?
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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by Dave on Sat Jan 19, 2013 12:43 am

Double overhand, yes. No other grip will do for grip training. I am setting my grip as a support grip, not a crush grip. As such, grip failure involves my fingers simply opening and the bar rolling out. No pinching of the finger pads for this guy. :grrr!:

SGDLs - Here's the thing: Since I only own 275 right now, I figured the way to make the most of it would be snatch grip/deficit (for the added ROM) and high reps to stimulate adaptation. You know, make the most of a "light" weight. But I've never really trained the conventional deadlift beyond sets of 5. I also have not done a work set of conventional since the last time I was at the gym, maybe mid-November? So for all I know I may now be a ton stronger in them than I was. That was the plan from the start, and within another few weeks we'll know for sure.

Which calculator did you use for that by the way?
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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by CheesedogTheFirst on Sat Jan 19, 2013 2:30 am

Way to set some PR's!!! :twisted:
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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by Dave on Sat Jan 19, 2013 1:37 pm

Thanks Cheesedude.

Last night after work I walked up the wall and held a few short handstands and did about 4 or 5 negatives. I'll do the same today and possibly get in a full session, depending on how I feel after 11 hours of work.
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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by itlives on Sat Jan 19, 2013 3:08 pm

Yay! Works' back!
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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by Cesar on Sat Jan 19, 2013 10:44 pm

Ok not too sounds ignorant but...explain snatch grip/deficits
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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by Dave on Sun Jan 20, 2013 12:09 am

Snatch grip is just wider grip as used in the snatch. Deficit means pulling from lower than normal for greater ROM (i.e. standing on blocks, weight plates, or in my case a sheet of plywood on top of a pile of folded up cardboard boxes).
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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by Journeyman on Sun Jan 20, 2013 12:59 am

Dave.cyco wrote:

Which calculator did you use for that by the way?

Me... lol.
A 350 snatch grip DL would be pretty nice.
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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by Dave on Sun Jan 20, 2013 10:49 pm

No full session today after all. At least not yet. Might not do one until tomorrow, but:

Kneeling OHP
65 x 8
135 x 1, 1, 1, f
115 x 4

135 is a new PR in the strict press for me.
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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by Journeyman on Mon Jan 21, 2013 12:42 am

Congrats! 1 plate for the first time is a good milestone. How much you weighin' now?
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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by Dave on Mon Jan 21, 2013 12:46 am

Thanks Jman. In my paper log there is a spot for weight, and every time lately I just write 190(?). I don't own a scale. I'll pick one up soon.
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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by Journeyman on Mon Jan 21, 2013 12:53 am

So, according to john mccallum when you can press that for 12 reps you'll have good shoulder development for your size... 75% x12 was his stated goal I think.
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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by Dave on Mon Jan 21, 2013 1:06 am

Good to know, thanks. Maybe 155 x 12, then, since I hope to become 20 pounds heavier.

Before bed:
OHP
115 x 7

And then my handstand practice including 3 negatives.


Last edited by Dave.cyco on Mon Jan 21, 2013 2:25 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by Dave on Mon Jan 21, 2013 2:25 pm

OHP
115 x 3
135 x 2 - PR again. :)
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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by itlives on Mon Jan 21, 2013 3:00 pm

Congrats on another PR! Hard work pays!
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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by Dave on Mon Jan 21, 2013 3:01 pm

Thanks, but the truth is I have hardly worked on OHPs at all up until now.
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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by Dave on Tue Jan 22, 2013 5:26 am

January 22, 2013

Squat rack warm up

High Bar Squat
165 x 50 in 3:13. Wholly kow I'm getting faster at this, despite going 10# heavier each session (and getting crappy/not enough sleep). :shock:

I wonder when I'll hit the point of diminishing returns. I still have 175, 185, 195, 205, 215 and 225 to go, so I'm not even halfway there yet. But I am starting to think I'll be able to hit my 225 x 50 goal way ahead of schedule, possibly even this cycle. Will I do it in 3:00-5:00??? :sparta:

Low Bar Squat
275 x 5
225 x 12

HeSPU practice
Only managed one concentric rep, so I switched it up and just did about 10 minutes of walking up the wall and doing an eccentric single every 0:30 (the first three reps were not recorded).

Video

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Table of contents
1:11 - High Bar Squat 165 x 50
4:55 - Squat 275 x 6
6:17 - Squat 225 x 12
7:37 - Handstand practice

The music I was training to is various NES game music covered by bands, and does a pretty good job keeping me amped.
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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by Rastaman on Tue Jan 22, 2013 5:45 am

Dave on the HeSPU's, if your still working the 5" high books (apologise - cant see your vid on my IPad) might be worth dropping back an inch or so and adding another book. Build up a bit of volume and work the movement pattern and then push again at 5".

I know it feels like your regressing, but I found that when I was pushing too much and failing often... I was expecting to fail on each rep. Sort of makes the visualising hard. If that makes sense.

It took me a long time to go from 1/2 reps to full HeSPU.



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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by Dave on Tue Jan 22, 2013 5:49 am

Thanks Chris. I just kicked the block out of the way and did full ROM negs. I actually forgot to do my visualizations today... Time to build a new habit!

As for the video - It's been almost an hour uploading. It's going to take another couple minutes due to being so large (234 MB). Almost there though!
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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by Rastaman on Tue Jan 22, 2013 5:51 am

.... And I've been cursing the IPad for the last 20 mins! Lol.
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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by Dave on Tue Jan 22, 2013 5:52 am

Sorry man I should have put a disclaimer... :oops:

Anyway, it's ready! :cheers:
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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by Rastaman on Tue Jan 22, 2013 6:17 am

AWSOME vid Dave.

The first 50 squats looked brutal! I'm sure the quads are fried now :twisted:

Your form on the HeSPU's is pretty good. How close to the wall are your hands - only looks to be a couple of inches! I tried to do a HeSPU that close to the wall after finishing your video and struggled to do 2 reps.

Disregard my earlier advice, as I haven't really worked them with the same form your using. When you progress to free standing, your going to have a pretty solid base with respect to balance.

Alex's tip of turning the hands outward a bit really helped with my wrist discomfort with Planche leans, may work with Handstands?
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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by Iliander on Tue Jan 22, 2013 6:22 am

Them squats... :twisted:
Any quad soreness? :mrgreen:

Great session.
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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by Cesar on Tue Jan 22, 2013 11:18 am

Awesome video, Dave.
You must be feeling those quads...how are your shoulders?
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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by Dave on Tue Jan 22, 2013 2:30 pm

Thanks Ili and Cesar. Quads were sore right after the session, but now they feel fine. Shoulders are fine. Rastaman was definitely right about negatives being easier on recovery.
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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by Dave on Wed Jan 23, 2013 2:37 am

Update: After a day of work I admit I was a little ahead of myself by saying my quads are fine. I really felt them after walking around on them for a while, to the point where the soreness kicked in hard on my bike ride home.
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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by Dave on Wed Jan 23, 2013 2:38 am

I also seem to have semi-consciously eliminated bench pressing from my cycle. Not to worried about it this time around, as OH pressing and HeSPUs are more important to me right now.
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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by ccheatum on Wed Jan 23, 2013 7:55 am

Dave.cyco wrote:Update: After a day of work I admit I was a little ahead of myself by saying my quads are fine. I really felt them after walking around on them for a while, to the point where the soreness kicked in hard on my bike ride home.

Whew! I was starting to worry that you were either superhuman, doping, or really secretly 19! Great job on the squatting. Now, you are feeling the reward for your hard work.
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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by Cesar on Wed Jan 23, 2013 10:48 am

Dave.cyco wrote:Update: After a day of work I admit I was a little ahead of myself by saying my quads are fine. I really felt them after walking around on them for a while, to the point where the soreness kicked in hard on my bike ride home.

AWESOME!!! good work Dave...
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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by Rix on Wed Jan 23, 2013 1:11 pm

Leg muscle soreness is the worse, specially when you go to work and every step is torture
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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by Iliander on Wed Jan 23, 2013 1:16 pm

Never had a torturous muscle soreness, tbh...

Except for calves, after I did a lot of calf raises, but wasn't too painful.
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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by Rix on Wed Jan 23, 2013 2:58 pm

:o lucky. lol, i suppose when i dont get the right nutrion in or do something stupid i suffer greatly. i hate leg and chest soreness, just feel it whenever ii move
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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by Iliander on Wed Jan 23, 2013 3:03 pm

I thought this was a different thread... :oops:

Sorry for :hijack:
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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by CheesedogTheFirst on Thu Jan 24, 2013 1:48 am

Great video Dave!!! You're really putting in the hard work.
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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by Dave on Thu Jan 24, 2013 4:19 am

Thanks. I'm getting a lot stronger. Not the skinny kid I used to be (i.e. skinny and weak), but still very skinny, due to poor recovery habits - and probably lack of hypertrophy specific training, though that will come after the Lenten fast (which could see me go down to 180 or 170(!!!). I think after Lent I might give the ol' GVT a try. Never done it before and I think it would work nicely with high bar squats, OH presses, snatch grip deads, pushups and pullups. That leaves 2 days for rest and recovery. Any thoughts on this?

Anyway, today's math lesson:

:pushup1: + :press: + :curl: + :bike1: without :eat2: or :sleep: = Lanky cyco :headbang:

It was easier when I was training clients, because I could sleep 4 hours here, 6 there, and rack up more than enough Zs. Despite that I'm now committed to a solid 8-12 hour block of work each night, my body still wants to sleep for only 4-6 hours (and I can only afford one sleep "session" per day now). It doesn't help that I'm a weboholic too.
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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by Dave on Thu Jan 24, 2013 5:34 am

Just had my first contrast shower in quite some time. I forgot how cold the cold water can get when it's around -19°C outside (that's minus 2 for you Fahrenheit lovers).
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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by Cesar on Thu Jan 24, 2013 10:09 am

Dave.cyco wrote:Just had my first contrast shower in quite some time. I forgot how cold the cold water can get when it's around -19°C outside (that's minus 2 for you Fahrenheit lovers).

contrast showers are great...they wake you up and energize
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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by itlives on Thu Jan 24, 2013 1:24 pm

You guys are crazy! I like my long hot showers (in winter).
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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by Cesar on Thu Jan 24, 2013 1:54 pm

itlives wrote:You guys are crazy! I like my long hot showers (in winter).

Mike - try it.
I haven't done it in a while.
but cold in the AM to wake up
hot in the evening to go to sleep.

awesomeness
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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by Dave on Fri Jan 25, 2013 4:42 am

Okay this week has to be deload and reload. I've worked almost 24 hours of the last 48, and my sleep has been the pits, so something's got to give. And it's going to be training. I did a little maintenance with 225 when I got home tonight and last night, like a single or double of each Back Squat, Front Squat, Deadlift (four of these actually) and some handstands, this time with my back to the wall.

I am torn between back to wall and belly to wall. Really what's the difference? I seem to be able to focus more on my forearms with my back to the wall, because if I lose balance, I can still stay up and push with my fingers until I regain balance. Also, I feel like the pressing groove is more appropriate with back to the wall, because it is more like an OHP, whereas belly to the wall feels like may arms are too far out ot the sides and elbows flaring...

I don't know man, handstands are demoralizing. Maybe it's just my shitty recovery getting to me. Whatever I'll come back stronger next week with a new cycle. 3 weeks (+ deload) of the 50 reps squats was okay, I'll pick up where I left off (175) later in the first quarter, perhaps, unless Lent conflicts with it. I'll have to look at the liturgical calendar later and figure that out.
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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by Iliander on Fri Jan 25, 2013 5:31 am

Choose one of the 2 ways to do a handstand with wall support and stick to it. IMO back to wall is better.
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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by Journeyman on Fri Jan 25, 2013 5:58 am

x2 on choosing one or the other.

Belly to wall if you want to focus on freestanding, just don't rest too much weight on the wall. I haven't done many of these, ask josh or alex.

Back to the wall if you want to use handstands/HSPU more for pressing carryover/strength building.
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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by ccheatum on Fri Jan 25, 2013 7:44 am

Dave, I like back to wall for building strength, but if you want to try to get to freestanding, then you need to work belly to wall or just plain freestanding so that you can develop the core strength and body control.
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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by Dave on Fri Jan 25, 2013 3:42 pm

I will stick with back to the wall because it is more familiar and because I have more use for strength than I do for the cool, but novel ability to do freestanding HeSPUs.

Maybe I'll think about freestanding in the future, but without the strength base, what's the point... I appreciate the advice guys.

And last night I fell asleep almost immediately after I logged off the forum and slept for 10 hours! I feel like a new man! ...aaaand now I understand my client wants another 20-24 hours of work from me between today and tomorrow.

Haha, don't look a gift horse in the mouth I guess...
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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by Josh T. on Fri Jan 25, 2013 3:50 pm

Basically what Jman said. Although, if you ever want to do FS HeSPUs, then belly-to-wall. It allows you to groove the pattern better.

The only difference is the ability to maintain a hollow position in the HS...it's easier to do with Belly to Wall than Back to Wall. back to wall predisposes you to an arched back. Again, nothing wrong with that if you don't care about having an arched back HS when you ever come off the wall. But if you want the prettier of the two, belly-to-wall is the way to go.
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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by Dave on Fri Jan 25, 2013 4:01 pm

I have always had an arch when doing any handstand work, so neutral would be like learning to crawl all over again. A lot of the old time handbalancing books (e.g. Hand-balancing for Muscular Development, by Bill Hinbern) show guys doing arched back handstands as well, and to my thinking these would likely be easier to keep balance in? So a neutral handstand would be more advanced?
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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

Post by Josh T. on Fri Jan 25, 2013 4:13 pm

Not really. The gymnastic handstand is easier to hold because your joints are all 'stacked' on top of one another in a straight line. So it would be like wrist-elbow-shoulder-hips-knees-ankles and you'd be able to draw a straight line throughout. When you are arched, you are not 'stacking' your joints, and it makes it more difficult-ish to balance for longer periods of time.

Bottom line - stacked joints = more biomechanically efficient.

Again, neither one is 'wrong' though. The gymnastic handstand eventually developed into the straight line one out of the 'increased' aesthetic appeal.
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Re: Going From Lank to Tank

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